Need your help desperately in fretwork patterns...

[cyclone1]

Dear members:

I have been searching the internet for fretwork patterns for baskets, boxes, lamps, etc. I have found Wildwood, but I heard that its not of a good quality. The other point is, they are expensive and refused to give a discount for bulk purchase.

If any one has a source for a good quality patterns sites, books, or other sources, then kindly extend your hand of help and let me know about it. All your help is very much and highly appreciated.

Mike,

[jttheclockman]

Mike

I do not know where you heard those remarks about Wildwood but they are simply not true. They are perhaps the cheapest place to buy patterns of many different desiners and they are the designers patterns. Wildwood has their own designers or buy other designers patterns and call them theirs. They have the cheapiest prices on inserts but also remember there is different quality there so the price reflects that. But comparing apples to apples they are the cheapest. As far as getting a break on bulk buying the only thing they will do and if you order off their web site you will get free patterns and the more you order the more free stuff you get. Just remember to mention it.

Other sites to get patterns are:
http://www.steebar.com/
http://www.theartfactory.com/videos.htm

http://www.berrybasket.com/
http://www.finescrollsaw.com/examples.htm
http://www.scrollsawcentral.com/
www.thewinfieldcollection.com
www.cherrytreetoys.com
www.woodenteddybearonline.com
These are some of the few there are so many free patterns on the web just do a google search for free scrollsaw patterns. Hope this helps and don't be so down on Wildwood from what you heard. They are the largest company around.

One other thing to remember is you can create your own pattern with todays drawing programs available on the net and also you can create your own patterns by taking two or three patterns and combining them or interchanging things. The sky is the limit.

[GrayBeard Phil]

Mike:

Could you clarify just a bit on "Good Quality". Just what are you looking for in the way of good quality? Usability of delivered plans? Clarity of delivered designs? "Quality" defined by expert scrollsawer, or new hobbyist scrollsawer?

As for Wildwoods, many who visit this forum site purchase patterns from Wildwoods. I have never heard any problems with usability of their designs. Don't confuse "quality" of delivered product with any sense of "Artistic" design. The "esthetics" is a completely different thread where my opinion, I promise you, will not match your opinion on art.

But anyway:
Rick's place http://www.scrollsaws.com/
Berry Basket http://www.berrybasket.com/BerryBasket.asp
Cherry Tree http://www.cherrytree-online.com/

All three about same as Wildwood as price and "quality". I doubt there is any "discount" from any of them.

And I am just curious about your usage of the term "bulk discount".

There are a few custom designers of scroll saw patterns who charge a fee like any other draftsperson / graphic artist for their talented services. If you are going into production / manufacturing of products for sale in retail stores, this is where you should be. You purchase the unique design for your exclusive use for as many copies as you want. Then you program it into your CNC laser cutter and produce thousands of copies.

If you are looking to get into the handcrafted business, doing craft shows, why do you think you need bulk discount? Again just asking. Normally, when you purchase a pattern, you are granted the right to use the patterns to make products for sale as a "craftsperson". That is built into the price of the pattern purchase. High volume production is a very different subject.

I am sorry if I read your post the wrong way. Please don't be offended.

Phil

[Mick Walker]

I agree with all of the above. Have never had a problem with anything I have ever purchased from Wildwood. Have ordered patterns and clock parts from them. They always send my orders by Priority mail. Mick.

[cyclone1]

jttheclockman, Phil & Mick:

Thank you all for your kind replies. Here is the truth:

I'm new at the scroll saw technique, but I have always loved anything made of wood. I'm learning how to scroll saw, and it's going on well with me.

I apologize if my comment about the quality have offended all of you. As I was searching and asking few other people, someone mentioned to me that he bought a design from wildwood, but wasn't happy with the quality. He didn't specify any more comments to elaborate on the reasons.

Anyway, as the three of you said that wildwood is a good place to buy patterns with good quality, then I should listen.

About the bulk discount, I was thinking to do as many patterns as I can and display them in shows or sell them to shops, etc. I have been doing other type of business in the past, and I know for a fact that buying something I need in bulk can save me some money in a long run, rather than to buy few patterns every now and then and pay full price.

I have tried my best to contact wildwood and tell them that I will buy several hundred of patterns, but I need some discount for my purchase, but no use. I have contacted a site, and they have happily given me a good discount for just 50 patterns I was interested in. They won a sale, plus a customer. A fact that wildwood is not interested to win my order.

This is why I asked you to help me out. I do appreciate the links and the ideas that you have given me. This make you all the best people I have ever met, and make this site No. 1.

I'm still open for any ideas or suggestions.

Thank you all,
Mike,

[3_M]

All you people are 100% correct about Wildwood, add one more vote from me.
Mike, why don't you get first a book like the one from John Nelson. Scroll Saw Workbook. It is one of the better books to learn scroll sawing from.
Why in the world would you buy that many patterns at a time, when you are just a beginner? "I'm new at the scroll saw technique" quote by Mike. You can also go to www.mikesworkshop.com and click on "Selecting a Blade" and "Q & A".
You will find a lot of good information to get you started in scroll sawing.
Mike M

[GrayBeard Phil]

Cyclone1:

Thanks for the details on your original post.

My suggestion is to get a free current copy of ScrollSaw Workshop (see link on the right side of your screen) and maybe a couple of back issues. Each issue of the magazine comes with a pull out large sheet (both sides) full of plans for scroll saw work.

But a few side points if I may (you may ignore if you already know these):

Since you have a woodworking background, be aware that many scroll saw designs are meant to be made using a no void plywood such as Baltic Birch, Apple plywood, or furniture grade A-1. This is for breakage as well as other problems that plywood overcomes. Solid wood does have its place in fretwork, but it is not always the "best".

Many times the projects are sanded before cutting because the act of sanding delicate fretwork can cause breakage. The goal here is to select the blade, stroke per minute of saw, and stock feed rate to avoid, or reduce to absolute minimum sanding of the project.

Scroll sawing is a learned skill. Eye and hand co-ordination thing. In some other woodworking areas, one can trade a power tool or a fixture / jig in exchange for learning a skill. Not so in fretwork.

Phil

[jttheclockman]

I would just like to add something because you now mentioned the other fellow had a quality issue not sure what they meant but if it is and have heard of errors it is not Wilwoods fault unless it is their pattern. I ran across an error in the design of a pattern but it was the designers fault and they were notified and it was corrected. As far as not getting a discount I am sure if you had talked to a supervisor and not the ladies that take the orders you would have gotten somewhere maybe not 50% off. If you got that then I would say you did quite well for yourself because I wouldn't even give you 50% off any of my designs.

What Phil and Mike M. told you about starting out is wise and to get to the point where you can stack cut to save time will take a learning curve. Also you will find it is not advantageous to make so many mulitples of one thing because they will not sell unless you are planning to do a QVC thing then be careful about legalality rules. Just a heads up. Like to see some of your work so maybe you can post in an album or include in the message. Good Luck and Happy Scrolling.

[Bigfoot]

Slow down

Mike,

I’m also new to scroll saws, but I’ve tried to learn the right way. I got the Scroll Saw Workbook and worked with the examples. I then tried my hand at making baskets, and now I’m trying to make fretwork picture frames. I read all the postings on this forum for advise, and the experience that others have and that I need to learn.

Doing fretwork the right way takes time, you’re inside and outside corners should be sharp, and your round edges should be smooth. All this takes time to learn, so that you don’t mess up your hard work, and also waist money on wood. You have to know which way to turn the wood so that you don’t nick you design. You cannot always run you saw at full speed, a lot of work has to be done at half speed or even less, and this means you cannot feed your blade the wood any faster than it can cut it.

Remember, the work you turn out represent you as the artist / craftsman. If you turn out top quality work all will recognize it, both your customers and your fellow scroll saw artist. But if you turn out low quality work, all will recognize that too.

Do the scroll saw patterns that interest you, and that you think you would enjoy doing. If your doing them just to make a buck, eventually it is going to become a grudge to make anything and your quality of work will suffer and you could lose interest in working with the scroll saw altogether. That means the money you spent for your saw, all those patterns, and the wood is lost. Or worse gathering dust in a corner somewhere.

So my advise is slow down, enjoy what you are doing and when you have built up enough finished work and it does sell, you can be proud of what you have done, and know that it is the very best that you can do.

The very best advertisement for anything is word of mouth, not some craft show.

Bigfoot

[GrayBeard Phil]

Bigfoot:

Wow! Well written post. Very good, thoughful post.

You should post more often, and please do.

Phil

[sheltiecarver]

Gosh, Bigfoot, how eloquent! I strongly second everything you just said.

Sandy

[cyclone1]

Bigfoot:

My hat off to salute you.

Phil, Mick, Mike M, J.T.:

Thank you all very much for standing by my side and showing me what I should do. This caring only shows in a "family", aren't we?

I will follow of all of your advises, and i hope to excel one day.

Mike,

[Bigfoot]

Wisdom is yours

Mike,
You have just become a very wise man.
Just remember to pass on your wisdom, to any new scroll sawer that you may be fortunate enough to meet in the future.
I hope to see some of your work when you have finished them on this forum.
May your hands be steady, your blades be sharp and never break or bend, and may your eyes be keen.
Bigfoot